Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: Bad performance from in-wall sub system

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10

    Bad performance from in-wall sub system

    In short: I'm experience poor performance from Triad subs and I'm at a loss. I could use some insights as I'm diagnosing this with my designer / installer. There are couple of issues. Perhaps the most speaker-specific one is the 12" Silver on-wall seems incapable of producing 20Hz and below at any reasonable volume. It starts chattering and vibrating playing low-frequency content at moderate volumes, in a way that I've never heard before from a quality home theater sub.

    The longer story...

    I've got a brand new custom home theater, designed and installed by a local company that sells Triad speakers as its "entry" platform. My theater has good acoustical design with custom designed treatments. It's a 7.2.4 design with Silver LCR from fronts and Bronze Satellite for surrounds and in-ceiling Atmos. The subs are two 10" Bronze in-wall in the front and a 12" Silver On-Wall on a side wall (installed as an in-wall). The subs are powered by two Triad 700 RackAmp DSP (one for the pair of Bronze and one for the Silver).

    Overall the system sounds decent. But the bass performance is far below my expectations. I'm still running audio demos, but my current inclination is to call it terrible. My experience so far is that a ~$4000 Triad system composed of three subs is underperforming my single $1000 SVS PC12+ sub in my living room.

    There are two issues I experience:
    1) physical vibration of the wall that the 10" Bronze subs are installed in. This might be an installer issue more than the subs per se.
    2) the 12" Silver sub gets chattery or rough sounding during low bass -- bass that my SVS PC12+ seems to handled without the same issues.

    At the moment, the room is tuned using a Audyssey MultEQ 32XT on a Marantz 7702mkII, and Dynamic EQ is turned on and Dynamic Volume is off. That is, I'm listening at low to moderate volumes (well below "Reference") and Audyssey is boosting bass to compensate the lower overall volumes. But "Night Mode" is disabled.

    I happened upon a movie scene that illustrates the problem very simple: The 2005 movie "Bolt" (Disney, animated, about a lost Dog) near the end of the 2nd chapter where Bolt jumps in slow-motion over a helicopter. That scene is sonically sparse, with just a very low bass of the slow-motion helicopter blades "whump whumping" (I'd guess below 20Hz). In that scene, the front wall shakes and the Silver Sub sounds like its trying to rattle itself out of the wall.

    I've raised the issue with my installer and he's contacting Triad to make sure there wasn't a simple detail missed during installation.

    I appreciate any insights into Triad performance and limitations, trouble-shooting approaches, or possible solutions. Thanks.

  2. #2
    Administrator DigitalDawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    71
    Can you tell me where the subs are installed in the room? A room diagram would also be helpful.

    Normally Triad dealers know how to install InWall and OnWall subs. Quite honestly, the only time I've experienced what you are describing, is when the subs are not tightened down correctly, or when the RackAmp isn't configured properly.

    One other thing you can try is to disable all Audyssey settings to see how the subs sound without any processing.

    Take a look at the RackAmp 700 guide we have here in the forum. You can find it here.
    Authorized Dealer: Triad Speakers, Denon, Marantz, Emotiva, Sony,
    JVC, Screen Innovations, Stewart Filmscreen, Panamorph, and Oppo.


    Contact us for assistance, we are happy to help.

    Dawn@EgretElectronics.com
    561-745-6186


  3. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10
    Top view of room. Subs highlighted in red.
    Subwoofers Top View.jpg
    Front wall. 10" Bronze subs on bottom.
    Subwoofers Front.jpg

    Right wall (if facing screen). 12" Silver sub on bottom.
    Subwoofer Side.jpg

  4. #4
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10
    This was experienced first with the installers settings.

    Then this weekend I set the Amps to Low Bandpass of LFE and High Bandpass of 20 Hz, with a 24 slope (I think) to eliminate as much of the Triad processing as possible. They were set to Bronze IW and Silver IW, respectively.

    I then ran Audyssey on my receiver to calibrate the room. This changed the relative levels at which the behaviors manifest. But it still happens at moderately loud volumes, 80 dB to 90 dB from the main movie.

    I'm going to listen to more content to see what sounds good and what has problems.

  5. #5
    Administrator DigitalDawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    71
    The sub locations aren't what I would have chosen. Did you try removing one ore more subs to see if the vibrations ceased? Also, did your installer order the InWall Bronze subs in an 8 ohm configuration? This is necessary when using a single amp to power two subs.

    I still want you to check the frame screws on the in-walls. Make sure they are tightened down really well.

    I would be very interested to hear what Triad says about all this.
    Authorized Dealer: Triad Speakers, Denon, Marantz, Emotiva, Sony,
    JVC, Screen Innovations, Stewart Filmscreen, Panamorph, and Oppo.


    Contact us for assistance, we are happy to help.

    Dawn@EgretElectronics.com
    561-745-6186


  6. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10
    Thanks for the comments. The sub locations are constrained by room limitations: their locations are in new constructed walls, since I was working with an already finished space. And the sound was optimized as possible with professional acoustic analysis.

    I don't if the subs are 8 ohm. I don't have easy access to the subs; I'll be talking with the installer about corrections and diagnostic options.

  7. #7
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10
    There's the structural issue with the front wall (10" subs) vibrating in some cases.

    The other is the Silver On-Wall seemingly unable to handle low frequency output. What is the limit or capabilities of the Silver sub? I'm still working to make sure my perception is correct and that I'm not skewed from my experience with an in-room sub. But my impression so far is that the Triad Silver Sub doesn't work well at low frequencies found in movies. But this is my first experience with Triad or in-wall subs.

  8. #8
    Administrator DigitalDawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    71
    I own a silver sub and it has no problem in the low-end department.

    Please post back after you talk with Triad.
    Authorized Dealer: Triad Speakers, Denon, Marantz, Emotiva, Sony,
    JVC, Screen Innovations, Stewart Filmscreen, Panamorph, and Oppo.


    Contact us for assistance, we are happy to help.

    Dawn@EgretElectronics.com
    561-745-6186


  9. #9
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10
    Thanks. My installer is checking into it.

    I'm wondering if there are special requirements for installing in-wall subs? Does the wall need to be especially reinforced to ensure the sub doesn't cause rattling?

  10. #10
    Administrator DigitalDawn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    71
    Outside of standard stud spacing, no, InWall Subs don't need any type of special reinforcement.
    Authorized Dealer: Triad Speakers, Denon, Marantz, Emotiva, Sony,
    JVC, Screen Innovations, Stewart Filmscreen, Panamorph, and Oppo.


    Contact us for assistance, we are happy to help.

    Dawn@EgretElectronics.com
    561-745-6186


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •